InsideEVs Podcast - Can Ford's Sub-$30k Fathom EV Truck Beat Slate?

[tubes]

My wife was looking for a new to her vehicle went to a Ford dealership since that's what we both drive and a used car priced at 24k with their 1.99 % interest rate for 60 months came out to $512 a month we both looked at each other and said nope if that's what the market is like now we would rather drive what we have until the wheels fall off.

Yes, it means about $5k of shenanigans were slipped into your deal. Being generous, call it $3k of shenanigans if the other $2k go to tax, title, registration.

 

[adele]

+1

I think people who appreciate a simple vehicle don't go around talking about it much.

Same goes to people concerned about their privacy. I expressed a concern about the upcoming mandated driver-watching camera law and learned to just keep opinions about that kind of thing to myself. Fortunately the most offensive comment appears to have been deleted now.

In my experience, people “concerned about their privacy” love to go around talking about it. In fairness maybe that's more in my own quirky social bubbles than a lot of online conversations. I get the sense that many people are overly paranoid, but we all make our own choices.

 

[AZFox]

I get the sense that many people are overly paranoid, but we all make our own choices.

Your "sense that many people are overly paranoid" is exactly why so many learn to keep to themselves about it.

Turns out it's nearly impossible to reason someone out of an idea they didn't arrive upon using reason to begin with.

 

[fxrdr31]

Yes, it means about $5k of shenanigans were slipped into your deal. Being generous, call it $3k of shenanigans if the other $2k go to tax, title, registration.

right why can't a vehicle just be what the price says

 

[Freyar]

Your "sense that many people are overly paranoid" is exactly why so many learn to keep to themselves about it.

Turns out it's nearly impossible to reason someone out of an idea they didn't arrive upon using reason to begin with.

"You're overly paranoid" is a common response I get.This is how we end up with Flock, traffic stops that are assumed valid by the State when a simple check of the plate or VIN would do (I won't get into worse situations involving the state, I'm sure people can imagine), 20-25% increases in insurance premiums (or outright refusal) and so on.

The privacy argument has real impacts and people just ignore them for convenience, yet I hear in a not-so-infrequent cadence that I'm paranoid.

 

[AZFox]

The privacy argument has real impacts and people just ignore them for convenience, yet I hear in a not-so-infrequent cadence that I'm paranoid.

It's a lot easier to call someone paranoid than it is to admit you've been duped.

 

[tubes]

Here's the thing. It isn't even all about Big Corporate doing nefarious things with your data. What has become very clear with devices like Ring and Flock is that you have rogue employees examining data or video for their own nefarious purposes. With Ring, it was employees overseas doing who-knows-what with doorbell videos.

Flock is another level. At least around here, it is mostly LEOs or people in the LEO offices checking up on ex girlfriends/boyfriends, or maybe even checking out some random person they met. It is scary stuff, and although Flock claims to put brakes on this activity, the damage is done. After years of obscurity, suddenly everyone knows about Flock and the incredible amount of tracking they do. I personally now avoid Lowes if possible because most Lowes stores in my area are Flocked. I used to be a Lowes shareholder too. Not any more.

I really don't need random automobile manufacturing employees checking on my location or what music I listen to, or maybe even pictures of me picking my nose.

 

[AZFox]

Here's the thing. It isn't even all about Big Corporate doing nefarious things with your data.

It's about not thinking it through and bocoming aware of the Unintended Consequences, and there are many.

I commend Slate for not selling owner data.

Ironically by not monetizing your data they'll be monetizing privacy.

 

[tubes]

Unintended Consequences, and there are many.

Amen!

 

[whasupjohn]

It's a lot easier to call someone paranoid than it is to admit you've been duped.

No I’m isn’t.

Phillip J fry.

 

[Freyar]

Here's the thing. It isn't even all about Big Corporate doing nefarious things with your data

Generally? Sure. Though the state has its own serious consequences for misuse (LEO is the state after all), and automotive manufacturers flat out tell you they will misuse that data for profit.

 

[adele]

Your "sense that many people are overly paranoid" is exactly why so many learn to keep to themselves about it.

Turns out it's nearly impossible to reason someone out of an idea they didn't arrive upon using reason to begin with.

The thing is, it's not a debate. There's no difference in belief. We all agree on the facts. I fully believe that all kinds of data about me and my daily habits and my internet history are being collected without my knowledge and being sold to various corporations and governments and people. Personally, I just don't live my life any differently on account of that knowledge.

Other people make personal choices to protect their privacy, and I would never tell them not to; their choices don't affect me. Yet they criticize me for making personal choices that don't affect them. They'll tell me a bunch of stuff I already know about how my data is being used, expect me to have some kind of immediate emotional reaction, and assume that the emotional reaction makes their "argument" for them.

@AZFox, my apologies if the above characterization does not apply to you. It's not really directed at you specifically, it's just me being reminded of some exhausting IRL conversations I've had. I don't mean to put words in your mouth.

 

[AZFox]

@AZFox, my apologies if the above characterization does not apply to you. It's not really directed at you specifically, it's just me being reminded of some exhausting IRL conversations I've had. I don't mean to put words in your mouth.

No worries @adele. If you're aware of the risks and making an informed choice (which is unusual) then go for it.

For example, if going to your church and being "geofenced" there, then later being fed a stream of targeted propaganda by a foreign country as a result, doesn't bother you like it would bother me then I'm willing to accept that, as long as you realize it's happening, and it is. Millions of dollars are being spent on that kind of thing. I think it's creepy and would prefer not to participate.

I just believe most people have no idea that this kind of thing is going on.

 

[slp]

Generally? Sure. Though the state has its own serious consequences for misuse (LEO is the state after all), and automotive manufacturers flat out tell you they will misuse that data for profit.

While abuse by the state is egregious, for me it is about security every bit as much as it is about privacy. When a custodian of collected data is breached, that data will be published, putting me at risk. That's "when" not "if" because, with things like Flock, I don't trust that local jurisdictions have the best practices around authentication and authorization. I wouldn't be surprised if there were shared accounts without MFA.

 

[Freyar]

While abuse by the state is egregious, for me it is about security every bit as much as it is about privacy. When a custodian of collected data is breached, that data will be published, putting me at risk. That's "when" not "if" because, with things like Flock, I don't trust that local jurisdictions have the best practices around authentication and authorization. I wouldn't be surprised if there were shared accounts without MFA.

It's only getting worse.