If the Slate PU came only as an ICE, I would buy one.

[brian10x]

Slate is not just any EV either, it was designed from the start to be as simple as possible. It therefore over time should have low maintenance costs. And I always DIY any repair that I can.

No front wheel drive eliminates 1/2 of the drive train parts. Plus there is therefore no front motor or front inverter to cool.. No heat pump. Affects overall efficiency but is certainly a simplification. Eliminates several parts that will not need to be maintained.

The rear drive train consists of the EDM and a couple of CV half axels. I am guessing (hoping) that in the event of catastrophic failure this unit can be replaced with a DIY operation. Maybe buy a replacement unit from a junk yard.

I am guessing the HVAC unit is high voltage and maybe also the PTC heater. I will certainly ask Slate about the difficulty and any personal risk there is to work on these units. If I can I will. I expect that everything else will be 12 volts.

In summary, I am expecting to minimize maintenance cost due to Slate being a simpler vehicle with relatively fewer parts to fail and to do it myself.

AXLE. Forum spelling NAZI back on duty.

 

[SichuanHot]

Slate is not just any EV either, it was designed from the start to be as simple as possible. It therefore over time should have low maintenance costs. And I always DIY any repair that I can.

No front wheel drive eliminates 1/2 of the drive train parts. Plus there is therefore no front motor or front inverter to cool.. No heat pump. Affects overall efficiency but is certainly a simplification. Eliminates several parts that will not need to be maintained.

The rear drive train consists of the EDM and a couple of CV half axels. I am guessing (hoping) that in the event of catastrophic failure this unit can be replaced with a DIY operation. Maybe buy a replacement unit from a junk yard.

I am guessing the HVAC unit is high voltage and maybe also the PTC heater. I will certainly ask Slate about the difficulty and any personal risk there is to work on these units. If I can I will. I expect that everything else will be 12 volts.

In summary, I am expecting to minimize maintenance cost due to Slate being a simpler vehicle with relatively fewer parts to fail and to do it myself.

I'm also hoping Slate delivers on that promise of it being a simpler vehicle to DIY, but the jury is still out on that. Simpler is kinda a misnomer when it comes to this expectation we all have because a lot of thought and engineering still has to go into making the car DIY friendly.

Older BMWs and Mercedes did this in mind (E46, E39 and older). Almost everything in the engine bay of a BMW E46 is designed with eventual maintenance in mind. Everything is easily accessed and can be unbolted in the M54 engine in a logical manner. For example, the electric cooling fan on manual transmission cars simply slides out once the plastic rivets are removed. Slate needs to emulate this kind of "designed for maintenance" if they want to keep marketing it as DIY friendly.

 

[KevinRS]

Yeah, some manufacturers are going the opposite direction, where to service the vehicle they are using a special lift and taking the whole body off the chassis. Even in the 80s on many vehicles to replace a radio or work on the AC controls you had to take most of the dash out.

 

[E90400K]

Yes... But the cost to develop and set up production for just a single modern emissions compliant engine family from scratch, not even including the transmission, is in the hundreds-of-millions of dollars... So like at least 50% of their entire fundraising so far. The only realistic ICE option would be to buy from a brand that has zero interest in competing in the same space, like Ineos does in using a BMW engine in the Grenadier.

Yes, said startup can buy engines from another OEM. Many cases of that in the industry, especially with transmissions, axles, steering systems, etc.

 

[E90400K]

I'm also hoping Slate delivers on that promise of it being a simpler vehicle to DIY, but the jury is still out on that. Simpler is kinda a misnomer when it comes to this expectation we all have because a lot of thought and engineering still has to go into making the car DIY friendly.

Older BMWs and Mercedes did this in mind (E46, E39 and older). Almost everything in the engine bay of a BMW E46 is designed with eventual maintenance in mind. Everything is easily accessed and can be unbolted in the M54 engine in a logical manner. For example, the electric cooling fan on manual transmission cars simply slides out once the plastic rivets are removed. Slate needs to emulate this kind of "designed for maintenance" if they want to keep marketing it as DIY friendly.

The E30 heater core design was pure engineering genius. As was the HVAC fan.

 

[Dorbiman]

Not really, a few respondents have focused on one model, the Honda Civic, that requires a valve lash check at 100,000 miles, BFD. Like I'm way wrong. Not. The Civic is such an outlier in the realm of the entire diversity of ICEV models in the market. That's why its amusing.

And are we Slate Enthusiasts all not excited about DIY modifications? Adding the SUV kit, audio systems, electric windows, drop kits, lift kits, and DIY a wrap to give the truck some color. A valve adjustment (check) is not that complex of a procedure (shims/buckets are a bit more difficult). Oil changes every year, oh THAT'S a deal killer.

I don't think those things are in the same category. Adding modifications ≠ maintenance.

 

[Sandman614]

Just because all the parts associated with these two systems mostly don't rotate or move, they are still prone to failure. As a thrifty DIY'er, do you have the skills, training, test equipment, and tools to diagnose and repair the EV HVAC and drivetrain controllers?

What happens if Slate does a poor job designing their high voltage battery junction box (HVBJB) like Ford did with its Mustang Mach E, or Tesla did for that matter (early on). Or improperly engineers the low voltage battery maintainer system, again like both Tesla and Ford did? Do you have the tools, training and skills to fix such systems and components once your Slate will be out of warranty?

I've been DIY diagnosing and repairing automobiles for nearly 50 years since before I could drive. I had to learn the skills because I couldn't afford a new car when I was a youngin'. What once was out of necessity has now grown into a hobby, DIY diagnosing and repairing cars. I lack the training and tools to diagnose and repair EV systems. My ICEV training was all self taught. Think Slate is going to let you dig into its high voltage battery to repair it? I bet not.

Again you're completely missing the point. You're coming at this from a mechanic perspective, we're all talking about this from an ownership perspective as it relates to routine maintenance, not complete component or system failures.

Regardless of EV or ICE, for the vast majority of vehicle owners a complete system failure is going to result in a trip to a shop. You and many other enthusiasts, myself included, are in the minority when it comes to doing our own maintenance or other larger jobs.

One of the sales pitches for Slate is the simplicity. From an owner perspective, an EV is far simpler as it relates to routine maintenance. The idea is that if you are going to go barebones simple on the rest of the vehicle, might as well go barebones simple on the drivetrain and the associated maintenance. Again, from an owner perspective, not an engineering or mechanic perspective.

 

[E90400K]

Again you're completely missing the point. You're coming at this from a mechanic perspective, we're all talking about this from an ownership perspective as it relates to routine maintenance, not complete component or system failures.

Regardless of EV or ICE, for the vast majority of vehicle owners a complete system failure is going to result in a trip to a shop. You and many other enthusiasts, myself included, are in the minority when it comes to doing our own maintenance or other larger jobs.

One of the sales pitches for Slate is the simplicity. From an owner perspective, an EV is far simpler as it relates to routine maintenance. The idea is that if you are going to go barebones simple on the rest of the vehicle, might as well go barebones simple on the drivetrain and the associated maintenance. Again, from an owner perspective, not an engineering or mechanic perspective.

I don't think I am missing the point. The point I am making is Slate's premise is the machine is highly configurable with its requirement to wrap it for any color than gray. It can be converted to a 2-door SUV. It can have electric windows added. It will need an audio system installed. The owner can customize the apparence via 3D printing of parts and pieces. There will be factory-offered suspension kits. The interior can be upgraded via factory kits.

All of these attributes are keyed towards owner DIY installations as the company states. The company is going to have its Slate University in support of owner's DIY endeavors. Certainly, a modern ICEV with its associated, now minimal, service intervals, which other than oil changes are mostly at the 100,000 mile mark and beyond are no more of an ownership burden than installing an SUV kit, or re-wrapping the body every few years, as examples.

So past that, the ownership experience involves DIY repairs, where most here indicate EV will have less breakage because its electric rather than combustion powered. Why is it unreasonable for me to expect that a manufacturer who is keyed to DIY of personalizing their product by its owner not expect owners to also want to DIY repairs? My opinion is, while most think EV are simplistic and easy to repair, I don't think they are. I think most DIY-motivated owners will not have the skills and tools to diagnose and repair the EV drivetrain, battery cooling and charging systems.

If Slate is relying on only enthusiasts wanting to delve into DIY personalization and the majority of non-enthuisast owners will outsource their personalization, then Slate's business model seems ill-founded.

 

[Sandman614]

Because those are all "get to"s, not "have to"s. Like another poster said, mods are not maintenance, and not all people that mod want or can do maintenance. And vice versa.

 

[E90400K]

Because those are all "get to"s, not "have to"s. Like another poster said, mods are not maintenance, and not all people that mod want or can do maintenance. And vice versa.

So, you are trying to say that a Slate owner who wants to DIY install the suspension lift kit, if he owns an ICEV can't or won't perform a simple oil change or spark plug replacement. Nah. Come on. If he is going to outsource a simple ICEV maintenance item like an oil change, he will certainly not attempt a suspension replacement on an EV Slate truck.

 

[Sandman614]

So, you are trying to say that a Slate owner who wants to DIY install the suspension lift kit, if he owns an ICEV can't or won't perform a simple oil change or spark plug replacement. Nah. Come on. If he is going to outsource a simple ICEV maintenance item like an oil change, he will certainly not attempt a suspension replacement on an EV Slate truck.

All these weird hypotheticals you've come up with have completely moved away from the original intent of the conversation that is to state for most people the simpler maintenance of an EV is a selling point that goes along with the simplicity ethos of Slate. That's it, I'm done with this conversation and following you down this rabbit hole. Bye.