Jeff Bezos's $25,000 EV Truck Has One Fatal Flaw • Jeff Jablansky | MotoMan Podcast 006

[E90400K]

And introducing an inventory challenge, how many to manufacture and inventory of each color vs a single color x times number of unique panels.

JIT manufacturing, the industry has been doing it nearly 50 years. And, a thing called a computer has been invented, and now AI too. It really doesn't add complexity to the assembly process.

 

[sodamo]

The idea is they are getting thousands at a time of the about a dozen or less different grey parts, likely sourced from another company, and they are all the same. 5 colors means 60 parts instead of 12.
Maybe later they would add new base colors, but colors are going to mean another layer of quality control, you don't want to get your red truck and find out the color of the door is a bit off from the shade of the quarter panels.
Grey is also probably easier to deal with getting right with UV blockers/inhibitors.

I think there would be more tolerance of varying grey knowing the answer is “wrap” but greater intolerance of non matching color panels. When I worked in the industry color matching as a never ending quality control.

 

[AZFox]

Understood, but it's changing color pellets in the injection molding machine.

That's way easier said than done.

Radical Simplicity doesn't work that way.

Five colors would require be five times the replacement body panel SKUs.

Replacement panels in those colors probably wouldn't match body panels that have been out in the weather for a few years anyway. If a wrap is faded, just re-wrap the whole thing and enjoy the opportunity to change the color.

 

[E90400K]

That's way easier said than done.

Radical Simplicity doesn't work that way.

Five colors would require be five times the replacement body panel SKUs.

Replacement panels in those colors probably wouldn't match body panels that have been out in the weather for a few years anyway. If a wrap is faded, just re-wrap the whole thing and enjoy the opportunity to change the color.

That doesn't make the original assembly more expensive. And if the idea is "radical simplicity", then why two battery sizes, an electric window option, electric locks, why even offer a pre-cut wrap kit of multiple colors?

 

[sodamo]

JIT manufacturing, the industry has been doing it nearly 50 years. And, a thing called a computer has been invented, and now AI too. It really doesn't add complexity to the assembly process.

Point of clarity, I said inventory, not assembly. Could be wrong, but guessing each panel not going to be moulded as needed. Yes, I’m assuming there will be 3rd party manufacturers.

 

[E90400K]

Point of clarity, I said inventory, not assembly. Could be wrong, but guessing each panel not going to be moulded as needed. Yes, I’m assuming there will be 3rd party manufacturers.

That is what JIT is, a method of production with low inventory costs.

 

[sodamo]

That is what JIT is, a method of production with low inventory costs.

I humbly stand corrected, everyone knows 5x anything is never more complicated or costly vs 1x. And as you so humbly point out on any thread that challenges, you are never wrong. My apologies. Will attempt to be better.

 

[Driven5]

Polypropylene is naturally an undesirable milky white and NOT naturally UV resistant. The UV stabilizing additives will also affect color pigmentation. So not only does each additional color require unique formulation to achieve equivalent properties, it may not even be possible to achieve it in a desirable version of the color. Gray is easily the most accepted 'plasticy' color on new cars... The only other easy to UV stabilize in an 'ok' automotive look *might* be black. Non-grayscale colors would probably all pretty much look like hot-garbage to most potential customers. There is a reason Saturn still painted their cars despite the body panels also being molded in color.

So as I see it, the decision matrix puts additional plastic colors as increasing both the logistical and technical cost without the necessary equivalent increase in revenue.

 

[Mac-Tyson]

That doesn't make the original assembly more expensive. And if the idea is "radical simplicity", then why two battery sizes, an electric window option, electric locks, why even offer a pre-cut wrap kit of multiple colors?

You are seeing this more as trim levels and options instead of what they are which is accessories. The only option is a standard range and long range battery which is likely due to the battery being the most expensive component in the vehicle. So offering a cheaper option that has less range but a more expensive longer range version was worthwhile compromise. But outside of that every single Blank Slate comes off the line the same way.

Slate isn’t building each unique truck that is made in the customizer. You get the accessories with the Truck which can be installed yourself or by their service center partners. But you still get everything included in the base truck. For example, from my understanding when you choose the power windows accessory. You aren’t getting them instead of the roll up windows you are getting the power windows in addition to the roll up windows. Which honestly I like because if the motor breaks or dies but I don’t want to fix or replace it right away I can just re-install the roll up windows instead.

The reason for this radical simplicity is it allows them to achieve the economies of scale quicker and likely also decreases the upfront costs of getting production going on this vehicle. Which is the other aspect you aren’t accounting for this is a startup that is aiming at making an affordable vehicle instead of a low volume halo vehicle like most startups. One of the biggest cost savings they have highlighted is the fact that they don’t need an entire paint shop. They saved 100 million dollars by focusing on having every Blank Slate be Slate Grey. But they are still focused making the truck affordable by designing it with wrapping in mind. Which also allows you to customize the Slate in much more unique ways at an affordable price than it would be if it was paint instead.

 

[wellwater]

New here today and joined because I see the thing that would push us to a different EV is vehicle to load/home ability. I asked Slate the other day and the rep said they will not be offering it.

 

[Mac-Tyson]

New here today and joined because I see the thing that would push us to a different EV is vehicle to load/home ability. I asked Slate the other day and the rep said they will not be offering it.

This thread is more of a discussion about what was discussed in the video posted. I would recommend making a new thread post to discuss about vehicle to load capabilities.

I would also recommend posting in this thread if you haven’t already: https://www.slateforums.com/forum/threads/introductions-welcome-thread-👋.13076/

 

[wellwater]

This thread is more of a discussion about what was discussed in the video posted. I would recommend making a new thread post to discuss about vehicle to load capabilities.

I would also recommend posting in this thread if you haven’t already: https://www.slateforums.com/forum/threads/introductions-welcome-thread-👋.13076/

 

[KevinRS]

With only the 2 battery options being the only 2 different versions that will roll off the assembly line, all they need to know is how many trucks are being produced today, and how many of each battery. The battery part only those on that short part of the line even need to know or be concerned with. every truck going down the line gets the exact same parts added at each point in the line, the whole line except the short branch where the battery is added.
This really is going back to the way the first model T lines worked, nothing custom, no variations.

You don't need a computer system to track by VIN number that this truck will be red, and have leather seats, sunroof, upgraded headlights, and the 3rd of 5 different sound systems, if they are all the same. All every station on the line has to do is add the same parts to every truck.

Everything else is accessories that probably don't even enter the same building. Most will probably be fully made and packaged, with slate branding, at outside facilities, run by other companies. When you order the truck, and accessories at the same time, to install yourself, they may be shipped separately, from different warehouses in different parts of the country.

 

[Doug T]

I know that there is plenty of things that can go wrong, but this is a remarkable overall plan. Make the factory production line as simple as possible by building essentially one product. Have a potentially unlimited number of accessories available that are delivered with Amazon-caliber efficiency.

 

[E90400K]

I humbly stand corrected, everyone knows 5x anything is never more complicated or costly vs 1x. And as you so humbly point out on any thread that challenges, you are never wrong. My apologies. Will attempt to be better.

No need to apologize. You say its more complicated to have a 5-color pallet of body panels vs. one color (gray), possibly true but how much more costly? You don't say. Is it $10 a truck? $20? $100? I think there is an opportunity benefit for Slate to offer a few base colors so those customers who don't want to deal with a wrap color change can get a color other than gray.

Slate states the cost savings in using a single MIC body panel appoach is in the capital cost avoidance of building a paint facility ($1B+), not in the logistics of assembling the truck with different colored parts. Makes complete sense. Yet, there is nothing new here, industry suppliers for automotive assembly lines figured out the parts control logistics decades ago. The color of the body panels is not a different assembly configuration.

Others state some MIC pigments are more prone than others to color degradation, yet they don't state which ones. When I studied plastics manufacturing that wasn't the case. Current searches on line indicate it is not a major issue. I have three vehicles with MIC plastic panels. White, gray, and blue. The blue tractor has some pigment fade on the hood, which is the panel subject to the highest heat load (from the engine), but the tractor is 20 years old. The white top on the golf cart, well it's still white. The Bronco's MIC top color seems to be pretty stable 3 years in.

Someone said new replacement panels will be off color to the rest of the aged panels, but that will be true with the Slate Gray plastic panels. The solution, have insurance pay to wrap the car to achieve matching color between the panels.

And somehow vinyl wrap, which is a MIC plastic, won't be subject to pigment degradation over time, but the base, unwrapped panels will. Good logic.

No need to get pissy just because I offer challenging topics to discuss.