So many posts about, will you still buy without EV credit [WARNING: NO POLITICS]

[hbuck]

I see a lot of posts about will you still buy if the ev credit goes away.

Here is my take on this.

For the quick answer, No.

Here is why, first off I love the idea behind Slate , so much that I have even applied for a few different positions with the company. However the Slate truck for me is not a necessary vehicle, I am big into modifying and customizing vehicles, I have been looking for a clean mini truck project like a 90s Mazda b2000, Toyota pick up, maybe even a S10 or Ranger.

I am not Pro EV or anti EV, I do not currently own any EVs, however when Slate announced the pick up I was very interested in this platform. I personally think for what you are getting ( as cool as it is to get a very basic truck) that the price with the EV credit is already pushing the max I would spend for this. Now I guess if your plans are to buy this to replace an existing vehicle and use it as a daily driver or use them as fleet trucks then the price with the EV credit is great, considering you get a new truck with a warranty. For me this is just another toy. I can go spend less then half of this on a clean 2wd 90s mini truck, and with the basic mechanics and fuel economy of these old 2wd, 4cyl trucks and the amount of time I would be using it, it would take me decades to spend the money in maintenance, fuel, etc to come close to spending the price of the slate without the EV credit.

So for me, I am hopeful the EV credit holds out long enough to get my reservation. I do not believe that Slate has enough margin to be able to bring the price down close to the price it would be with the EV credit.

The senate kills it at the end of the year. I wonder if the reservation is good enough for the feds to keep the tax credit, since billionaires are getting another tax cut.

 

[Benjamin Nead]

The senate kills it at the end of the year. I wonder if the reservation is good enough for the feds to keep the tax credit, since billionaires are getting another tax cut.

That's a refundable $50 "yeah, I'm kinda interested" deposit. You really don't start owning this thing until you make a real down payment (a couple thousand, maybe) and start signing legal documents. That might not start happening for most of us until sometime late next year (2026.)

I've been in communication with my 2 Democratic Senators for months now about clean tech cuts. They know me well. If you or anybody else reading this has Republican Senators, call the congressional switchboard TODAY (Mon. June 30, 2025) at 202-224-3121 and DEMAND they vote NO on this bill.

 

[hbuck]

That's a refundable $50 "yeah, I'm kinda interested" deposit. You really don't start owning this thing until you make a real down payment (a couple thousand, maybe) and start signing legal documents. That might not start happening for most of us until sometime late next year (2026.)

I've been in communication with my 2 Democratic Senators for months now about clean tech cuts. They know me well. If you or anybody else reading this has Republican Senators, call the congressional switchboard TODAY (Mon. June 30, 2025) at 202-224-3121 and DEMAND they vote NO on this bill.

I’m afraid my Texas Senators are a lost cause, never mind Elon moving his stuff to Texas.

 

[Benjamin Nead]

Shortsidedness is not understanding the entire infrastructure that generates electricity is supported by fossil fuel.

Not true. It's still more than it should be - and I'm afraid it's not going to get better in the next few years (especially here in uh-MERK-uh) - but to say the entire infrastructure will always be or currently is 100% supported by fossil fuel is truly defeatist. Interestingly, there's a lot of renewable energy utility projects in cue in the US for 2025. A lot of stuff that has been put on hold is tried up in the courts as well. But even sudden legislation attempting to can't suddenly cut off everything. And the Chinese and Europeans are doing their own thing, which is good.

Here's how it could be. Simon Clark isn't saying anything here that hasn't been carefully plotted by Saul Griffith, Mark Z. Jacobsen or Tony Seba. All the actual tech has already been invented and is only getting cheaper (unless taxed or tariffed unfairly) Worth your time to watch though to see where this can go. There about a minute's worth of a commercial in the middle of this 25 minute presentation on YouTube (hint: subscribe to Nebula to get a version without) . . .

 

[Neil Nelson]

Here in Utah I buy solar power from my electric utility, Rocky Mountain Power.

 

[evtruth]

Shortsidedness is not understanding the entire infrastructure that generates electricity is supported by fossil fuel.

Except more energy is now generated in the United States via renewables than with coal, which is the dirtiest form of fossil fuel used to generate electricity. Coal is dropping while renewables are increasing.

However, even when electricity to charge an EV IS generated with coal, it is still AT LEAST 3x CLEANER than the emissions from the average American combustion vehicle.

Then there's natural gas, the bulk of our generation, which is twice as clean as coal generation (so 6x cleaner than the average combustion vehicle).

Then there's the State of New York where 70%+ of the electricity is generated via nuclear and renewables. EVs in New York have an insanely quick carbon payback because of that.

 

[Benjamin Nead]

Here in Utah I buy solar power from my electric utility, Rocky Mountain Power.

Do you know that Utah is the only US state where it's legal to install so-called "balcony" solar? The JerryRigEverything channel on YouTube just put this one up today . . .

 

[Neil Nelson]

You have four solar panels giving during the summer around at 2.4 kWh each per day of 9.6 kWh. During the summer I am using 200 kWh per month that four solar panels will generate in 21 days. During the Winter I use 1000 kWh per month with four solar panels giving 1000/9.6=104 days. And then solar panels will only generate around 50% at best of summer power in the Winter making the 104 days 208 days. 208/31=6.7 times 4 or around 27 solar panels to cover my house requirements for the Winter. Hopefully it will not rain much during the Winter. And then I live alone in a small house. And then you need batteries to store energy for night time and when it is overcast or raining.

 

[dirkslinkhard]

I will get one regardless. The tax credit isn’t what sold me on this vehicle. If the credit does go away I think slate will have to lower the price very close to the $20k. They have to know that people will cancel their reservations if they don’t and that could be a big hit.

They stressed about affordability, so it has to stay in that low $20k. There are too many people that will not pay $30k for a featureless 2-door truck

 

[Neil Nelson]

Where else can you get a featureless 2-door truck EV for $30k new?

 

[SlateModGarage]

For me 2 slates are cheap cars for my kids to drive. I am ordering two and hope to write them off as test bed for some parts manufacturing. But I will let my girls test drive them to school and college.

Also, I just sold my 2001 Ranger with 200k miles and need $6k of work for the clutch and suspension (front and back) and rear axel needed rebuilding for $8k still. This idea of finding good used old small trucks here in SC under 10k without needing a lot of work is next to impossible here.

 

[OldGoat]

You have four solar panels giving during the summer around at 2.4 kWh each per day of 9.6 kWh. During the summer I am using 200 kWh per month that four solar panels will generate in 21 days. During the Winter I use 1000 kWh per month with four solar panels giving 1000/9.6=104 days. And then solar panels will only generate around 50% at best of summer power in the Winter making the 104 days 208 days. 208/31=6.7 times 4 or around 27 solar panels to cover my house requirements for the Winter. Hopefully it will not rain much during the Winter. And then I live alone in a small house. And then you need batteries to store energy for night time and when it is overcast or raining.

We generate solar and are really happy with it. It’s true that for now, battery storage for nighttime house appliances is expensive. But man, when storms have knocked the utility grid down, having battery juice is worth every penny. No stinking, noisy generator to fill with fuel. Very unhappy that Republicans are killing any renewable energy things they can and I will no longer vote for any of them.

 

[mthulhu]

I’m about 5 years out from needing a new vehicle, but yes I will still want it. There is nothing at that price range with this much style, innovation, and character. The virtues of “American made”, right to repair support, and affordable operating costs are also selling points.

In short, Slate’s appeal goes way beyond just being the cheapest car on the market for me. As long as it stays pretty affordable I’m on board. I don't believe the lack of a government subsidy will price me out.

 

[Neil Nelson]

We can generate the infrastructure without using fossil fuels. See https://www.solarpaces.org/solar-furnace-to-melt-steel-at-2000c-for-swiss-recycler-panatere/ Also see 'electrical smelters' on google.

 

[Benjamin Nead]

57% of US electrical energy is fueled by natural gas, coal and crude oil (with a 1.2% increase in the global electricity market). China just this year approved 95GW of coal power plant construction, the highest level since 2015. So, that's on the fuel side.

But I was actually speaking to the use of fossil fuels to create the infrastructure that is built to generate electricity. Hence the short sidedness on the entirety of the whole energy production picture. If you think the fossil fuel industry is going anywhere in the next 100 years, it's not.

And something like 94% of all new electrical generation installed in the US in 2024 was from renewable sources. But, as you'll almost certainly point out, the whole thing is a ruse because fossil fuels were involved in the manufacturing and deployment of said infrastructure, life cycle assessments be damned. Or the workmen were wearing safety hats molded from petroleum-derived plastics? Or that the solar panels and/or wind turbine blades required fossil fuels in their manufacture, at least here in the early to mid 21st century? I'm reminded that Bronze Age technology was required to transition us into the Iron Age. So, no, I don't share your opinion that we're completely stuck with fossil fuels until the the end of time, or the next 100 year, whichever comes first.

Look . . . you might smugly agree with the current administration that this whole thing is a green new scam. I don't and I'm not alone with my outrage that what is happening in Washington right now is not only an affront on me, but ultimately very bad for the economic future of this country. I would have preferred my next set of solar panels come from a US manufacturing concern. But If those firms are now kneecapped and all I have to chose from is Asian or European made stuff, so be it.

If my neighbors are still heating their homes with methane in 10 years time and living on
the precipice of perpetual fear that an international conflict half way around the world is going to make it too expensive for them to drive to work tomorrow morning, they've lost the battle, not me. I would have preferred to bring them into a more enlightened place. But if they don't want to come, I can't force them. I can only attempt to convince them.

So, you think the whole EV tax credit thing should go away and we should just buckle down and drive on gasoline until we can't any longer. But, hey, we'll be pure and virtuous going back to horse drawn carriages because, yeah, all those EVs were just really fossil fuel vehicles hidden behind the specter of batteries and magnetic motors. My argument is not just with fossil fuel proponents, but with green purists who are basically technophobes. You seem to be in one place or another. Hard from me to tell from just a brief online conversation. But I've moved on and you, apparently, haven't. Let's just leave it at that. Or, meet me on some dedicated forum where American made electric small trucks are just a conversational side meal, not the main course.