Dear Slate - you need to show these things before I'll buy

[SichuanHot]

You must not read the threads I'm in and all the push back I get.

To be fair you make good points that helps dissolve the sweet, cherry, and rose colored view many Slate enthusiasts on here have about the truck.

 

[E90400K]

To be fair you make good points that helps dissolve the sweet, cherry, and rose colored view many Slate enthusiasts on here have about the truck.

Just like everyone else here I want Slate to succeed, but I like to take a realistic view of things. I don't think any of us want to buy a Slate truck and have the company go bankrupt two years later. Establishing a new car company is a daunting task at any time in American history, especially an EV manufacturer in today's world. Tesla did it but it had a lot of financial help via Government investment (carbon credits and consumer tax incentives and tax breaks) and little if any competition, which led to a highly unusual stock evaluation from investors. The current environment Slate finds itself in is quite different than 15 years ago when Tesla was a startup. Had tesla been vying for investment funding from the market with five or six other established manufacturers it would have never made it. One has to question why so little private equity investment has not been thrown Slate's way in the view from how Tesla was funded.

It is exciting to see it play out and discuss the play with fellow enthusiasts here on the forum.

 

[SichuanHot]

Just like everyone else here I want Slate to succeed, but I like to take a realistic view of things. I don't think any of us want to buy a Slate truck and have the company go bankrupt two years later. Establishing a new car company is a daunting task at any time in American history, especially an EV manufacturer in today's world. Tesla did it but it had a lot of financial help via Government investment (carbon credits and consumer tax incentives and tax breaks) and little if any competition, which led to a highly unusual stock evaluation from investors. The current environment Slate finds itself in is quite different than 15 years ago when Tesla was a startup.

It is exciting to see it play out and discuss the play with fellow enthusiasts here on the forum.

You're absolutely correct. I think there's an adage somewhere that goes along the lines of "the biggest fans are also the biggest haters." We're all hypercritical of Slate because they claim to offer something novel in the industry, which we here all see as valuable.

 

[E90400K]

You're absolutely correct. I think there's an adage somewhere that goes along the lines of "the biggest fans are also the biggest haters." We're all hypercritical of Slate because they claim to offer something novel in the industry, which we here all see as valuable.

Maybe we are the biggest skeptics(?).

Which is why I've keyed in on the whole 600 vs. 6,000 parts claim Slate has made. It sounds great, but to me it's a bit smoke and mirrors. Such statements make me pause a bit on the whole viability of the experiment. I applaud the team at Slate for making the effort; it's heroic in a lot of ways.

 

[Doctors Do Little]

Maybe we are the biggest skeptics(?).

Which is why I've keyed in on the whole 600 vs. 6,000 parts claim Slate has made. It sounds great, but to me it's a bit smoke and mirrors. Such statements make me pause a bit on the whole viability of the experiment. I applaud the team at Slate for making the effort; it's heroic in a lot of ways.

Dude...I *like* my cherry-topped sugar fantasy about a plastic truck that I can let a teen learn on and runs solely on electrons. Don't rain on it too much with your logic and facts and fancy engineering degrees...else, I'll "Scooter" you (block your content). Just sayin'

 

[sodamo]

You know what really interests me about the group of potential Slate buyers on this forum is how unconventional they seem to be in many ways. It's a very different group than over on the Maverick forum, which is funny, because it seems like we have a lot of Maverick owners here (like me).

A lot more happiness with taking risks here, accepting uncertainty, willingness to buy what might be an orphaned vehicle. It's just kind of cool for me to see so many opinions that vary so widely about everything. Also, I don't see the "You suck. No you suck" threads here.

It IS possible, very possible to disagree and STILL be civil.

 

[sodamo]

You must not read the threads I'm in and all the push back I get.

Or give? 😁😁

 

[sodamo]

To me 600 vs 6000 is another silly waste of time, more important to me is the philosophy of multiple use of same part. Never made a lot of sense to me how so many things come as a left and a right when a common part could serve as either.

 

[E90400K]

To me 600 vs 6000 is another silly waste of time, more important to me is the philosophy of multiple use of same part. Never made a lot of sense to me how so many things come as a left and a right when a common part could serve as either.

Silly indeed. The Pintos, Vegas, and Pacers of the 1970s used numerous common left and right parts for the interior and exterior, as probably did Civics and Corollas (I'm not that familiar with the 1970's Japanese brands). I think once CAD/CAM became prevalent in the industry, making mirrored parts for left and right interior applications drastically cut the costs for production of such parts and allowed for much higher levels of interior designs without much increase in production parts.

But it does make sense even in these modern times to reduce design and production costs by application of universal parts. Great idea if the market accepts the practice (once again).

 

[RetiredOnPaper]

What if?
Slate goes under in 2 or less years?; 1.) As an early adopter that is the risk I an willing to take. 2.) I hope they stay true to their "off the shelf" parts. I just want to know who is making their motor/gearbox. If need be I know my way around a voltmeter. 3.) Actually the most critical piece will be the BMS and motor controller. If they fold after 2 years, junk yards will be a resource. If they fold sooner you have a collectors item.

Slate is outrageously successful? 1.) Like another brand that was originally cheap and simple and used during WWII, etc. Slate is a business and the lure of $$$ is strong.

I am nerd enough to have looked at what few views of the so called "body in white" and thought, how much can this be future proofed? Unlike most pickups this is not a cab, frame, bed. I liken it to a Pontiac Fiero; Tube frame with plastic body panels. Most future changes will probably be not obvious. A better performing motor, an AWD configuration. Change in battery choices.

As the man said, "You's pays you's money, you's takes you's chances."

 

[E90400K]

What if?
Slate goes under in 2 or less years?; 1.) As an early adopter that is the risk I an willing to take. 2.) I hope they stay true to their "off the shelf" parts. I just want to know who is making their motor/gearbox. If need be I know my way around a voltmeter. 3.) Actually the most critical piece will be the BMS and motor controller. If they fold after 2 years, junk yards will be a resource. If they fold sooner you have a collectors item.

Slate is outrageously successful? 1.) Like another brand that was originally cheap and simple and used during WWII, etc. Slate is a business and the lure of $$$ is strong.

I am nerd enough to have looked at what few views of the so called "body in white" and thought, how much can this be future proofed? Unlike most pickups this is not a cab, frame, bed. I liken it to a Pontiac Fiero; Tube frame with plastic body panels. Most future changes will probably be not obvious. A better performing motor, an AWD configuration. Change in battery choices.

As the man said, "You's pays you's money, you's takes you's chances."

I like the "outrageously successful" what-if!

The thing I have concern with is the shoestring budgets the company is under to bring the Truck to market. Maybe it's a good thing, though, as it is a small team and there is a really short communication chain to the CEO, which is always better, as has been my experience during my career. The only other concern I have is, is the business model that seems to rely on profits tied to the DIY/configuration aspect of the vehicle sustainable. One scenario the Slate team speaks to is the hand-me-down aspect of the Truck from parent to child, or older sibling to younger sibling (most of us have had this experience). In my case the vehicle was over 10 years old. Is Slate going to be able to economically keep SUV kits in stock for 10 years before the next owner gets the Truck and wants to convert it to an SUV? There are business operating costs and design implications tied into such a strategy. What is the mitigation plan?

GM's concept with the Fiero and the several other spaceframe/plastic-panel derivatives, was a base platform that was easily and inexpensively remodeled for next-generation lifecycle iterations of the vehicle. The Saturn company was entirely created based on that concept, yet it failed. I think it was and still is a great concept, let's hope it works for Slate.

 

[cadblu]

I like the "outrageously successful" what-if!

The Saturn company was entirely created based on that concept, yet it failed. I think it was and still is a great concept, let's hope it works for Slate.

Saturn produced vehicles for nearly 20 years. I wouldn’t exactly call that a failed concept. OEMs halt production on vehicles for a variety of reasons, mostly driven by diminishing demand, increasing capital expenditures and financial difficulties. If Slate can overcome the huge challenges faced by all startups, they can be successful and profitable in their second year of operations. They are currently ramping up their factory, staffing, supply chain, logistics, and third party repair services. The next nine months are critical and it will require “flawless execution” of their business plan. They need to get it right the first time around.

 

[RetiredOnPaper]

Having grow up in Motown, I have see the good, bad and ugly of the auto market. The fact that Slate spent 2 years in stealth mode and has Jeff B. as a backer gives me reasonable confidence they will make it to market.

My concern in the Michigan market is the dealership network. They hate EVs, They hate direct sales. They own politicians. And I am old enough to remember how violent they got when some dared to open on Saturdays. And, yes, I managed to witness some individuals deliberately vandalizing a Slate right under the noses of the Slate employees who at the time were naive enough not to be watching for it at an event.

If Slate is smart, they will structure pricing such that if they only sell the "Plane Grey Slate" they can eek by. All else will be gravy.

Having owned 2 Fieros, had friends that worked at the plant, and been a member of the Fiero owners club. It was my fantasy to build an electric version of the Fiero. Knowing what I do, it is almost better designed for that than an ICE car. If you are a car nerd enough to read this far, here is a treat...I once ran across a book in a library about the development of the Corvair and what the future design concept was for it (Before Ralf Nader)...

 

[bmello]

The “production hell” will be very real. It’s an incredibly stressful period, but also an exciting one.

I was involved in the Model 3 production ramp as a manufacturing engineer, and while it was intense, the camaraderie inside the factory and the very public pressure to make it succeed were powerful motivators. When everyone knows the stakes and there’s no room for error, teams can do some pretty remarkable things.

Right now, Slate’s manufacturing process teams and equipment teams are almost certainly deep into sourcing custom machines and tooling with long lead times. The facilities work alone is a massive effort. Anyone who’s done a home renovation can appreciate the chaos of scheduling trades, inspections, and materials, now multiply that complexity by ten. You’re pouring concrete footings, bringing in precision assembly equipment, coordinating electricians and pipefitters, all while the vehicle design and supply chain are still evolving.

That kind of concurrent engineering, designing the product and the production system at the same time, is challenging but honestly one of the most rewarding parts of manufacturing. The next several months will tell the story for Slate. If they execute cleanly and get the fundamentals right early, a lot of downstream risk gets reduced. I’m rooting for them and genuinely curious to see how they navigate this phase.

 

[E90400K]

Saturn produced vehicles for nearly 20 years. I wouldn’t exactly call that a failed concept. OEMs halt production on vehicles for a variety of reasons, mostly driven by diminishing demand, increasing capital expenditures and financial difficulties. If Slate can overcome the huge challenges faced by all startups, they can be successful and profitable in their second year of operations. They are currently ramping up their factory, staffing, supply chain, logistics, and third party repair services. The next nine months are critical and it will require “flawless execution” of their business plan. They need to get it right the first time around.

But the original Saturn spaceframe/plastic panel platform only lasted barely 11 years (MY 1991 to 2002). The original spaceframe architecture (derived from the original Pontiac Fiero platform) was a standalone architecture from the rest of GM's corporate products and was the basis for Saturn's independence from GM corporate with a new, non-union factory in Tennessee and an independent dealer network with its "no-haggle" pricing sales model. By the early 2000's, GM Corporate (and the UAW) sunk its claws into Saturn and pulled it back into the GM corporate fold turning Saturn basically into a reseller of rebadged GM corporate products based on non-spaceframe, steel bodied platforms.

That's why Saturn was unsuccessful, because the original intent of the company, which was to independently (from GM) design, produce, and sell unique spaceframe plastic automobiles lasted just over 10 years.