Is Slate's absence of telemetry an important distinctive feature?

[AZFox]

I don't know much about vehicle telemetry other that I think it has become pervasive and it's creepy.

In addition to the State Truck's unique "bring your own screen" feature, the Truck apparently doesn't Phone Home and tell the company what you've been doing with your vehicle.

There's probably some sort of black box (Event Data Recorder / EDR) that records some data that can be recovered after a collision. (It's mandated, correct?) I'm not referring to that.

What telemetry data do most vehicles collect and report that the Slate Truck will not?

 

[sodamo]

I think it’s the MANDATED part that’s most scary. What will be mandated in bits and pieces, like backup camera until the whole system has been added? Seems each little piece falls under the safety umbrella to minimize push back.

 

[AZFox]

I think it’s the MANDATED part that’s most scary.

I hope this won't derail the thread into politics. My intent is just to show that there will be creepy mandates unless we pay attention and stop that from happening.

A proposed piece of federal legislation aimed at mandating driver-facing cameras in vehicles was introduced in the United States Senate in April 2021. The bill, sponsored by Senators Ed Markey (D-Mass.), Richard Blumenthal (D-Conn.), and Amy Klobuchar (D-Minn.), sought to require the installation of driver-monitoring systems (DMS) in all new cars sold in the United States. This technology typically includes driver-facing cameras that use eye-tracking and facial recognition to ensure the driver is paying attention to the road​

More important -- for now -- is knowing what telemetry data is being collected and reported to the manufacturer by other vehicles that the Slate Truck will not collect and report?

Is it a compelling Slate Truck feature (where the absence of a feature is the feature)?

 

[Adam W]

The pervasive encroachment on our privacy is something I'm really concerned with, if that wasn't obvious from other threads already. I'll just touch on backup cameras for the moment.

Backup cam for my personal use in the vehicle: fantastic safety device.
That video being stored in the car and can be retrieved by law enforcement with a warrant? Ehh... maybe okay but toeing the line.
That same video getting uploaded to centralized servers like Tesla does where 1) employees can watch 2) Police can request without warrants 3)Ai gets run on those videos 4)who the heck knows what else. No f-ing way.

But let's say you trust your car company to not abuse the data, sell it to a data broker, share with insurance companies, or straight up give it to police without a warrant, etc. The data is still ripe for accidental leaks, and these databases are treasure troves for hackers. At this point we should all be assuming that any data that's collected will find its way into the wrong hands, and the only way to have any sense of control over that is to prevent its collection in the first place.

 

[adele]

For me personally it is basically the most important feature. I do not want my car to connect to the internet. Surprisingly, that single parameter narrows down my car-buying options to almost zero. That's why I'm rooting for slate!

 

[Garbone]

Good with no active wireless connection. However I do want the car to share state of charge via USB with my Navigation apps for charge stop planning.

 

[Duke Slater]

There’s 2 ways of looking at this.

Tech gives you the ability to see your vehicle’s location anytime/anywhere. If it gets stolen, you can tell police the exact parking space it’s in. You can also pre-cool/pre-heat the cabin, roll the windows up or down, see your charge level, tire PSI, and cameras when you’re away from it to make sure it isn’t being vandalized.

Lack of tech means you get none of the above, but the manufacturer can’t give police video of you sitting in a seat driving a car.

What are you doing in your car that you’re so concerned about police seeing?

 

[AZFox]

Good with no active wireless connection. However I do want the car to share state of charge via USB with my Navigation apps for charge stop planning.

[Serious question. Not trying to be a smart alec here.]

Can't you just look down at the dash?

I can determine my golf cart's available remaining range by looking at the 5-bar meter.

My 18-year-old Ford tells me how many remaining miles of fuel are in the tank.

I navigate with a map and my brain, not an app. <*drags knuckles*>

 

[AZFox]

What are you doing in your car that you’re so concerned about police seeing?

Enjoying living in The Land Of The Free where I can have privacy and not be monitored by Central Scrutinizers.

 

[Duke Slater]

Enjoying living in The Land Of The Free where I can have privacy and not be monitored by Central Scrutinizers.

You’re almost always on someone’s camera when you’re outside your home. There’s no legal expectation of privacy in public. Might as well use it to your advantage and get some perks out of it.

 

[Adam W]

What are you doing in your car that you’re so concerned about police seeing?

This is quickly going to get political, so I'm trying really hard here. But the things that are legal today can easily become illegal tomorrow. Some people today, depending on skin color, cannot go to a peaceful protest. An activity that's constitutionally protected for every person (not just citizens.).

What I do in my car is my business. Without due process, without some actual evidence that something is amiss, no law enforcement agency has the right to even inquire what I'm doing, let alone add my activity to a permanent database.

 

[AZFox]

You’re almost always on someone’s camera when you’re outside your home. There’s no legal expectation of privacy in public. Might as well use it to your advantage and get some perks out of it.

Framing privacy as something only needed by the guilty misrepresents privacy's purpose.

Privacy is not about hiding wrongdoing, rather it's about protecting individual rights and dignity.

It's also about preventing potential abuse of power.

Bottom Line: The "if you're not doing anything wrong" argument fails miserably when held up to scrutiny.

Expectation of privacy in public places is one thing. Constant surveillance by my automobile's manufacturer is something else entirely.

 

[Duke Slater]

Framing privacy as something only needed by the guilty misrepresents privacy's purpose.

Privacy is not about hiding wrongdoing, rather it's about protecting individual rights and dignity.

It's also about preventing potential abuse of power.

Bottom Line: The "if you're not doing anything wrong" argument fails miserably when held up to scrutiny.

Expectation of privacy in public places is one thing. Constant surveillance by my automobile's manufacturer is something else entirely.

Okay… I’ve driven Teslas for multiple years. I’ve always given them permission to the in-car camera (yes, there’s an option to exclude that). Most anyone’s seen is me sitting in seat looking out a windshield. Not grasping the concern here. Are you picking up hookers and getting some road-head? Drinking and driving? Give me one good reason why you care other than “I don’t like it.”

 

[AZFox]

What I'm wondering abut are things like Honda's privacy agreement posted by @Adam W in another thread.

Here's a few tidbits from Honda's privacy policy on connected vehicles that you opt in to when enabling seemingly innocuous "connected vehicle technologies" :

Covered Information We Collect:

• Driver Behavior Information such as vehicle speed, vehicle acceleration and deceleration, pedal positions, engine speed, direction, and time of travel, steering angle, yaw rate, vehicle control, and Honda Sensing/Acura Watch system settings and usage.
• Precise Geolocation information meaning the exact location of your vehicle at a specific point in time or over a period of time accurate within an area equivalent to a circle with a radius of 1,850 feet or less.

How We Use Covered Information

• Market first-party and third-party goods and services that we think would benefit vehicle owners;
• Protect our rights or property or the rights or property of others;
• Help protect the safety of you or others
• We cooperate with government and law enforcement officials and private parties to enforce and comply with the law.

There was a time when I fell in the "I'm not doing anything wrong, what do I care what data is shared?" camp. Today though, when what's legal and what's not can change with an executive order from a ||redacted||, or when law enforcement are happy to just ignore the law entirely, I'm more cautious about what info is collected and transmitted outside of my control, and take care to lock that shit down where I can.

 

[Duke Slater]

What I'm wondering abut are things like Honda's privacy agreement posted by @Adam W in another thread.

So things becoming illegal that were once legal? Talk about paranoid…

Plus there’s the fact that if you did something on a certain date that becomes illegal later, it was still legal when you did it. And even if you miss a memo, you’ll get pulled over and get a verbal warning that whatever you did is no longer legal (which will happen in any car, btw).

Still waiting on any downside to tech in cars.