Heat Pump vs Resistive Heater

[BahamaTodd]

Wonder if the target 150 mile range included summer and winter. A seasonal average and not just best case.

EPA EV range testing includes testing in 95*F and 20*F.

 

[G19Tony]

I'd rather have cooling seats living in hot desert Southwest.

Maybe it will have a Janitrol heater.

 

[lgerger]

I read somewhere that a heat pump had been confirmed. It seems like it would be a crucial part of an already small battery short range vehicle not losing too much range in adverse weather.

Agreed. This will be a huge consideration.

 

[Slashsnake]

Agreed. This will be a huge consideration.

That is a big piece If you live in the cold like I do.

I've got a 300 mile range and a resistive heater and that cold makes a huge difference.

With RWD you obviously would want to be removing those EV friendly tires and putting on some four seasons and losing 10 to 15% of your range.

Then unless they're using the more cutting edge/ expensive batteries for daily driving, you are likely operating in that 20 to 80%.

Then cut 30 to 50% for weather off your range... That's not a lot to work with for every day driving. A heat pump and seat heaters (what I use) can help, but doesn't seem either of those come with standard.

 

[GeoLogic]

Range is lamentably a major issue for those of us in colder locales, such as we in the PNW. For more than half of each year we must drive about using heat, defrost, wipers, and lights all on. Add AWD as I insist on having, and even the extended range battery on the Slate may not be sufficient for reasonable range. I love the Slate concept, but will have to see if the production vehicle is able to yield the range I wish. It may be that I have to await their v2 vehicle, with hope battery technology improves and comes down in price over the time it takes them to develop it.

AWD
SUV Configuration
~250 mile range with all electrical accessories on
Toyota reliability

My CR-V is retained, for as long as it takes, until there's an affordable electric vehicle with these qualities.

 

[Benjamin Nead]

I just got done in a chat and confirmed, no plans to go with a heat pump. This concerns me as I would think the resistive heat might use more power. but factually don't know that for sure.

It's true: resistance heating elements are going to be overall less efficient than a heat pump. Considerably so in some cases. But for all the cold climate dwellers out there, it's also true that heat pumps start to really struggle at the most frigid of temperatures inside a vehicle's cabin. So, on your coldest Montana winter morning, it's six of one and half a dozen of the other.

All that said, there's been a LOT of research going into heat pumps these past few years. We see the low temperature performance improvements first in residential equipment, like mini-splits and ducted home HVAC systems. Once those products are improved, the tech evolves into smaller scale stuff, for car interiors and residential hot water heating.

Earlier this year, I bought a washer/dryer unit that utilizes a closed loop heat pump system for the drying cycle. The old resistance heat dryer it replaced required a 30A 240V circuit. This new Samsung combo runs everything - washing and drying - off a single 15A 120V outlet. It performs beautifully. The only thing I don't like about it is the overly-complex touch screen interface. So, the Slate simplicity ethic would have been the one improvement I would make to this thing, if I could . . .

 

[Slashsnake]

Range is lamentably a major issue for those of us in colder locales, such as we in the PNW. For more than half of each year we must drive about using heat, defrost, wipers, and lights all on. Add AWD as I insist on having, and even the extended range battery on the Slate may not be sufficient for reasonable range. I love the Slate concept, but will have to see if the production vehicle is able to yield the range I wish. It may be that I have to await their v2 vehicle, with hope battery technology improves and comes down in price over the time it takes them to develop it.

AWD
SUV Configuration
~250 mile range with all electrical accessories on
Toyota reliability

My CR-V is retained, for as long as it takes, until there's an affordable electric vehicle with these qualities.

That's true. I have a model 3 (2020, before the heat pump addition) and that 300 miles when you add on 4 season tires (important for me with my AWD, but absolutely necessary for a RWD) instead of the efficient tires, and the cold weather and the 20-80 rule (for everyday driving), 150 miles range is not much. Figure 10% for the tire loss (about what I see) that's 135 miles. 20-80 rule (barring using newer pricier battery tech), that's 80 miles daily usable range. Cut 30-40% for cold weather....

And I get how crazy that sounds but I've got 310 miles of range when I got mine and have had 50 mile drives to get to Minneapolis where when I got home I was a lot closer to empty than I cared to be.

 

[metroshot]

That's true. I have a model 3 (2020, before the heat pump addition) and that 300 miles when you add on 4 season tires (important for me with my AWD, but absolutely necessary for a RWD) instead of the efficient tires, and the cold weather and the 20-80 rule (for everyday driving), 150 miles range is not much. Figure 10% for the tire loss (about what I see) that's 135 miles. 20-80 rule (barring using newer pricier battery tech), that's 80 miles daily usable range. Cut 30-40% for cold weather....

And I get how crazy that sounds but I've got 310 miles of range when I got mine and have had 50 mile drives to get to Minneapolis where when I got home I was a lot closer to empty than I cared to be.

Agree that cold weather is huge detriment for range.

Until we adopt a newer battery tech, the NCM batteries from over a decade ago has not changed much.

Luckily I live in a warm climate year around so I never see range losses in the winter months.

And I charge to 100% every time on L2 or Tesla Superchargers.

 

[bartflossom]

Desert Southwestern US - we need cooling seats and strong A/C for 11 months out of the year!.

Heater is rarely used.

In north Texas, we get the worst of all seasons.

 

[5ohbrad]

In north Texas, we get the worst of all seasons.

If you don’t like North Texas weather, wait a minute.