Slate Extended Range Battery - Price?

[ScooterAsheville]

I'm guessing they're measuring highway range, at 60+ MPH. That's where drag absolutely kills you.

Also there is all the drivetrain efficiency to be considered. Slate's going cheap by necessity. No money to engineer/purchase the most efficient motors or reduction gearing, or power electronics for that matter. Quality/efficiency costs money, or requires scale.

AI can take you to the drag equation and you can plug in the numbers to get a whole vehicle drag number at any given speed. That doesn't cover drivetrain losses, but it's a great starting point for vehicle to vehicle efficiency comparisons.

This isn't the best reference, because it's for my old field of aviation. But a Google search for "automotive drag calculator" might do better.

https://www1.grc.nasa.gov/beginners-guide-to-aeronautics/drag-equation/#:~:text=The drag equation states that drag $D$,drag * Wave drag * Induced drag

 

[catiare]

The only thing more bricklike would be a Slate with a Pizza sign on the roof.

You just described my favorite Slate config 😂

 

[KevinRS]

With the Ford truck likely having a larger frontal area, that may outdo Ford's likely lower drag coefficient. Also Slate does have some less noticeable work on the drag problem, they worked a lot in simulators before finalizing the design. They don't have the flush electronic door handles that tesla does that everyone complains about, but they are flush with the door, and the spoilers that detach airflow above the bed and at the tailgate, the hood and rooflines are intentionally curved.

 

[agrobotics]

The only thing more bricklike would be a Slate with a Pizza sign on the roof.

You mean like my Pizza Planet Slate Halloween costume? 😅

 

[agrobotics]

You just described my favorite Slate config 😂

You beat me to it, sorry.

 

[ezjob]

If that's how you look at it, it sounds like the Nissan may be a better choice for you.

Personally I wouldn't choose the Leaf if it cost thousands less.

It may be, but I still like the plain truck that I can work on myself. I will just have to wait and see what the Slate Truck is priced at with the extended battery.

If the Slate's price is just as much with nothing but an extended battery I'll probably choose another vehicle.

 

[AZFox]

It may be, but I still like the plain truck that I can work on myself. I will just have to wait and see what the Slate Truck is priced at with the extended battery.

If the Slate's price is just as much with nothing but an extended battery I'll probably choose another vehicle.

It comes down to whether the two are substitutes for one another. To you they are and to me they aren't. That's completely understandable.

The attractive features of the Slate aren't necessarily attractive for everyone.

My (loaded) way of putting it would be that I perceive Leaf is a meh Transportation Appliance chock-filled with electronics from a car dealer.

To the contrary, I perceive the Slate as a cool little American-made, direct-to-consumer, Small EV Pickup that's simple by design, customizable, and DIY-Friendly.

Put another way, if I want Hiking Boots I wouldn't buy Dress Shoes just because they are a better price, even though they are both shoes. To me that's the extent of the difference, but I certainly understand that's not the same for everyone.

 

[GaRailroader]

I perceive Leaf is a meh Transportation Appliance

As a former Nissan Leaf owner I take no offense to your statement ‘meh transportation appliance’

 

[atx_ev]

Scale. Nissan has scale. Slate has no scale. And scale is king, queen and emperor in the auto industry.

RJ Scaringe at Rivian has described this in multiple interviews. In the early years of Rivian with the R1 first gen, suppliers didn't want to talk with a BEV startup. Rivian flew to the suppliers and asked to meet. When they did meet, the prices were higher because the supplier was taking a risk Fast forward to second gen R1, and suppliers would talk and prices were lower. Fast forward to R2 and suppliers now fly to Rivian and solicited contracts at scale-pricing. That negoatiating power, enabled by scale and stability, is a big factor (also engineering) on why R1 and R2 costs to build the vehicle plunged to half and half again.

So Slate is at the starting line. Any supplier is happy to sell Slate off the shelf components at market price, no special mods needed. Anything beyond that means investments in tooling by the supplier, with a multi-year payback. So Slate is going to pay extra for any custom parts, especially at Slates pathetic scale (at full production it's still a small plant).

Many suppliers have gone out of business because they invested millions in tooling for a certain scale of production, on which the OEM then reneged. Writing a supplier contract is an exercise in who promises what, and who pays what when things go south. And even that doesn't help a Slate supplier if Slate goes into Chapter 11 with no assets left to pay claims.

If, and that's a big if, Slate reaches scale and stability, then suppliers will offer better terms.

Oh, I should add, the Slate is an aero brick. The only thing more bricklike would be a Slate with a Pizza sign on the roof. OTOH, who cares? The Slate is clearly designed for around town, low speeds. And at low speeds aero is almost an afterthought (drag scales around the square of velocity).

You talk about rivians scale causing costs to drop to 25% of original. But their scale is about 50k/year.
Im not saying slate will sell that much, but their factory is supposed to be able to produce 150K at full capacity.

 

[metroshot]

This was the most interesting thing I just researched. The Slate looks tiny because it's a short pickup, and pickups are typically huge, but while its small frontal area makes it way more efficient than any existing EV pickup, it's still way less efficient than a streamlined Leaf that is smaller still, so the Slate can't go as far, even with a bigger battery and almost 300 pounds less to tote around:

Metric	2026 Nissan Leaf (S+)	2026 Slate Truck (Ext.)	The "Penalty"
Battery Capacity	75 kWh	84.3 kWh	Slate +12% energy
EPA Estimated Range	303 Miles	240 Miles	Leaf +26% range
Efficiency (Miles/kWh)	4.04	2.84	Leaf is 42% better
Total Curb Weight	4,187 lbs	3,904 lbs	Slate is 283 lbs lighter
Drag Coeff. (Cd)	0.26	0.38	Slate is 46% "blunter"
Frontal Area (A)	≈24.4 sq ft	≈32.7 sq ft	Slate is 34% larger
Total Drag Area (CdA)	6.34 sq ft	12.43 sq ft	Slate pushes 96% more air
Height	61.3 in	69.3 in	Slate +8 in
Length	173.4 in	174.6 in	Identical footprints

But really, we're kind of comparing apples and oranges from an efficiency standpoint. The next interesting comparison will be to see how it stacks up with Ford's new EV pickup.

Slate's 2.8 mi/kWh is consistent with Ford's EV design at low speeds.

Remember, as speed increases, efficiency decreases.

As @ScooterAsheville noted that the limited range of the Slate is more suited for urban use as speeds are low and efficiency is higher.

As for my Ford BEV, I get around 3 mi/kWh around town / commute / low speed driving.
However at high speeds over 60 MPH, it drops to 2 mi/kWh.
Then add cold weather and it drops even more.

Where I live in warm sunny all year around weather, when I drove to Northern California recently on my monthly road trip, efficiency took a hit due to colder temps (40-50 degrees) and had to stop at an extra charging location along the way, compared to summer travel.

FREE 72kWh DCFC at CA DOT rest stop:

 

[beatle]

Yes, but by that rationale, "more suited for urban use" just means "sucks at highway." By the intrinsic advantages of how they work to recharge the battery on deceleration, all EVs are more suited for urban use.

The problem is that the vast majority of people only care about range when they're going to put a lot of miles on it a short amount of time, and that means highway use. The information about energy and range on the Monroney sticker should include both city and highway range estimates and not just the city/highway MPGe numbers which are useless. Actually they're worse than useless since they include variable charging losses, so it further confuses people when they try to calculate the range based on MPGe and battery size.

This is a simulated example of the Slate and highway vs city range using the advertised ranges for the battery, and the breakdown of the EPA test cycle's focus on highway vs city portions:

Battery Config	Metric	kWh/100 mi (Wall)	mi/kWh (Driving)	Calculated Range
Standard Battery	Combined	35	2.85	150 miles
($52.7\text{ kWh}$ usable)	City	31	3.23	170 miles
	Highway	40	2.50	132 miles
---	---	---	---	---
Extended Battery	Combined	35	2.85	240 miles
($84.3\text{ kWh}$ usable)	City	31	3.23	272 miles
	Highway	40	2.50	211 miles

 

[AZFox]

Yes, but by that rationale, "more suited for urban use" just means "sucks at highway." By the intrinsic advantages of how they work to recharge the battery on deceleration, all EVs are more suited for urban use.

I think "more suited for urban use" meant compared to other EVs that are aerodynamically optimized and have long battery range.

This is a simulated example of the Slate and highway vs city range using the advertised ranges for the battery, and the breakdown of the EPA test cycle's focus on highway vs city portions:

Your simulated example shows a 22.6% loss at highway speeds (2.5 vs 3.23).

Where do those values come from?

I think the Slate's highway-speed range penalty will be significantly higher than 23%.

It would help to know what qualifies as highway speed, because above, say, 60mph a small change in speed has a big effect on range, more and more as you go faster and faster.

Car and Driver:
How Does Speed Affect EV Range?

 

[catiare]

You beat me to it, sorry.

Happy to share my design!

 

[beatle]

Those are AI generated estimates, but they're based on the EPA test cycles and the 0.7 correction factor. I wouldn't take these to the bank, but I think they're somewhat useful in illustrating how the silly sticker only shows combined range, but most people really care about highway range. I wish they looked more like the mpg ratings, but I digress.

https://www.epa.gov/greenvehicles/fuel-economy-and-ev-range-testing

The EPA test cycles are also kind of garbage to estimate range, but at least they're more accurate for US driving than the European or Chinese tests which are ridiculously inflated.

I find that EV range estimates vary based on manufacturer and temperature (of course). For example, I take a trip to see family in July and for Christmas. This trip is fairly flat with no traffic since I do it super early in the morning. My R1T has an estimated 369 miles of range with a full battery. Average speed is 70 mph. I log the trips with ElectraFi, so I can see average speed, battery use, weather, distance, etc.

At 36F, it takes 72% battery (25% lower than rated)
At 74F, it takes 64% battery (15% lower than rated)

The R1T is a lot more aerodynamic than the Slate, but even my 2019 Model S which was more aerodynamic than the Rivian only got 71% of its rated range on that same winter trip under nearly identical conditions.

 

[Kopsis]

Battery pack costs for MNC are running around $120/kWh. There's a 31.6 kWh difference between the two battery packs, so safe to assume about $3700 minimum price difference between the two configurations. Slate is going to have to factor in the overhead of managing the two different production configurations, so I would expect to see the long-range option priced at about $4000 higher than the base model.